Sure, that'll work! Dylan (Klebold) did not do this because of the way he was raised, Susan Klebold told columnist David Brooks in Saturdays editions of The New York Times. He did it in contradiction to the way he was raised.. Hi Alison, We've hardly seen him & attempts to engage him have been futile. Dylan Klebold and Ryan Harris killed 13 people at Columbine High School in Colorado in 1999. And now she won't show it. . Posted February 7, 2011. The couple said they felt under siege after the shooting and never had a chance to grieve for their son. They always have, and unless we can change it (which might be very "Pandora") they always will. OP, I agree with you. For a couple reasons. however, in her book, sue shared a diary entry she wrote of an incident in the months before the massacre: 1/11/99 This long, hard day is over. That kid was born with some sort of brain injury. Is that correct? No matter how angry they were they wouldn't be able to kill that many without those weapons. He injured 2 students before his gun jammed and he was arrested. How can that not bother you? Sue would later find out through his journals though that by sophomore year he was battling depression and suicidal thoughts. Few more places I can't think of now. Most of you posters here are complete idiots and voiceofthenight is the biggest moron of them all. Every parent has flaws and every parent makes mistakes, but to me they mostly come across as a very normal family like there are millions all over the world. She is the author of A Mother's Reckoning, a book about the signs she missed of Dylan's mental state. Wayne & Kathy Harris' son is widely seen as the . He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. Susan Francis Klebold ( ne Yassenoff; born March 25, 1949) is an American author and activist. I honestly do believe (and so does mom) that his brain has been rewired primarily by a head injury he sustained when he was just toddling. Can you imagine having one of those monsters as your brother? Great job! Was Tom there for him when he needed him? By Eun Kyung Kim. Dylan Bennett Klebold. Wayne - who owned guns himself - told the clerk he hadn't ordered any clips. Very few people really care. Very exciting though, the progress we've made. Ten years after the Columbine killings, the Harris family has not spoken publicly at all, and the Klebold parents have given one interview, to the columnist David Brooks here at the New York Times. The owner (a woman) had no qualms about going up to people with a screaming child and saying "You need to take ze child out to ze car vare he can calm down. Dylan also writes in his journal that. These two need to be gutted and hung out for the vultures. . So we're back to Pavlov and Skinner. Hell, Klebold and a bunch of their friends went to the prom the weekend before the killings. After sitting and waiting for 13 hours, I just needed to get home. ", Dylan: (interrupts) "We did what we had to do. At approximately 11:19 a.m., Dylan Klebold, 17, and Eric . As the mother of Columbine High School shooter Dylan Klebold prepares to speak out in her first interview since the gruesome 1999 shooting massacre, a survivor of the attacks has . As a . Or it's everything. Funny how things cycle.". Reviews: 81% of readers found this page helpful, Address: Suite 369 9754 Roberts Pines, West Benitaburgh, NM 69180-7958, Hobby: Worldbuilding, Shopping, Quilting, Cooking, Homebrewing, Leather crafting, Pet. Virginia Tech. Eric . i dont particularly envision tom to be the type of parent to humiliate or pressure his sons. I wanted a contribution to help us understand why it happened, so that it would never happen again. I knew he was off, different. I've linked an article from Nature magazine about it. Dylan Klebold had written about a "god-like figure" dressed in black, brutally gunning down fraternity-type boys. On a calendar entry dated the day of the attack, April 20, the time 11:10 is written across the top an approximate reference to when Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold pulled out their weapons . Eric and Dylan worked extremely hard to conceal their machinations. "This was murder," he said. The interview is set to air on "20/20" this Friday, coinciding with . This is my story | Sue Klebold, (Video) Sue Klebold: My life as the mother of a Columbine killer (EXCLUSIVE) - BBC Newsnight, (Video) Chris Morris friend of Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, (Video) COLUMBINE SHOOTER: DYLAN KLEBOLD'S MOTHER GIVES FIRST TV INTERVIEW ! Or, as Eric himself said, quoting Shakespeare, in the farewell video he left for his parents: x93Good wombs have borne bad sons.x94. "Psychopaths don't feel guilty because they are blind to guilt," Ochberg said. He was easy to raise, a pleasure to be with, a child who had always made us proud (Klebold, 2016, p. 61). It is also true that environmental stimuli can make the difference between a kid with "problems" and a kid who becomes a "monster." Apologies in advance if this question has already been answered. In 1997 Wayne Harris, Eric's father, started logging all of his son's problems. Wayne worked as a transport pilot for the United States Air Force, while . She is the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the perpetrators of the Columbine High School massacre that occurred on April 20, 1999. I was in high school at the time. ", Dylan: (sticks his face in the camera) "Goodbye. But even if you work with them to avoid their *own* pain, that's a start. It was weird. That doesn't make them monsters. Tom Klebold said they hope to understand someday why the shooting happened. Yes, it's really terrible when there is the free-flow of information and ideas, isn't it? Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris killed 13 people on April 20, 1999, before taking their own lives. Brian Rohrbough, father of victim Daniel Rohrbough, said he was outraged that the Klebolds . Eric Harris was 17 and a hottie. Children learn psychopathy from their parents (e.g., the Bushes). This thread is going to hell in jig time if it turns into the all-too-familiar "they were running up and down the aisles and that caused Columbine!!!" Im looking for possible warning signs of trouble between these two individuals and their father-son relationship. You're far too stupid to ever see that though. . Not only would that give us someone to blame (someone still living, unlike Eric and Dylan, who turned their guns on themselves), but it would also allow the psychic distance between x93usx94 and x93themx94 that frightened humans crave. I think that even I have sustained some slight rewiring from that, though not anywhere *near* to the extent of my brother's. See? Eric was born in Wichita, Kansas. Klebold was depressed and fell under Harris's influence. Tom had a huge hobby for fixing up BMW's. Sue received a number of letters from people whod gone to Columbine who were more surprised that a shooting hadnt happened sooner than that one had happened at all. Mrs. Klebold had her hair done the day after the shooting. Some folks do indeed work from very primitive brain impulses. You shouldn't attack people for the actions of their offspring. I don't believe that Tom and Sue were annoying parents. School officials, law enforcement, and the adult community learned a lot after Columbine and are doing a better job of detecting trouble. Psycrotrenic, charter member of the International Reb&Vodka fan club. His parents were Wayne Harris and his wife Katherine Ann Poole. When early word came that the Trench Coat Mafia may be involved in the shooting, Tom ran downstairs to look for Dylans trench coat, which he couldnt find, Lozow said. That's the first thing. May 15, 2004. A Further Examination: Sue Klebolds case study of her son, Dylan Klebold, Trauma and Suicide within Law Enforcement, Mental Health and Mass Murders: The Connection between Trauma and School Shootings, Mental Health Treatment in Correctional Facilities, Forensic Behavior Analysis: Self Care in the CJ Field, Trauma in Female Juvenile Inmates and Delinquents. It Always seems like he didn't give a damn about them, in his writings and in the Basement Tapes. ERIC AND DYLAN 4 LIFE! x93Thatx94 happened to x93themx94 because they were bad parents, we could tell ourselves. Those kids were their responsibility legally. LITTLETON, Colo. Just 15 people attended the funeral of Columbine High School killer Dylan Klebold on Saturday two ministers, eleven mourners and two anguished parents wondering where they'd gone . They often have an interest in guns and weapons, with easy access to firearms, and have often repeatedly made clear their violent intentions to others (usually peers). Brooks Brown, now 31 years-old was a senior at Columbine during what was considered to be the worst school shooting in U.S. history. Ken Caryl Middle, where he met Dylan Klebold. She also spent a lot of time conferencing with my teachers to know how well I was doing in school and she was interested in my assignments. I go into Target and there are children shrieking like banshees in the shopping cart and the mother never says "Be quite. Reb". I can't find any photos of Eric's older brother, Kevin. For an optimal experience visit our site on another browser. Asking how points the way forward, and shows us what we must do. Real estate records indicate they bought their 10-acre plot in 1990 for $65,000. Spelling aside, Eric Harris had turned 18 about a week prior. For not seeing that, I will never forgive myself.. ", Eric: (eventually) "That's it. if anyone can correct or find the sources for me that would be greatly appreciated! Sue and her husband were vehemently opposed, but Dylan still asked for a gun for Christmas his final year. Teachers have no training in mental disorders or warning signs. He was also very close friends with the killers. We just share a brotherhood of admiration and belief in R &V. We sympathize with each other. They are rare. KleboldI started reading the Columbine book, how does he try to explain Klebold? So he called me and offered to go to the school in hopes of negotiating with Dylan. We are ich bin auslander! I guess it's my generation. VOTN, they used to think blood-letting and reading the bumps on people's head was science, too. Yesterday there was a girl in her backyard screaming like an insane person at somebody or something. How often did they fix things up, was he emotionally available for Dylan? Dylan: (predicting his parents' feelings of regret) "If only we could have reached them sooner, or found this tape. I think Tom had high expectations of Dylan and may have been a little bit of a nag, but in these regards he wasn't much different than a lot of parents. When I was in high school, i was friends with a guy who very well could have done what those kids did. The Harrises moved away almost immediately. After college, the couple married and settled in the Denver area. This is my (completely layman's) opinion, but I've always figured that we have more or less tamped down the "How" of the brain, but we're still working on the "Why" of the brain. The pair . So I'm gone. There is every likelihood that not a single teacher at Columbine cared enough to pay attention or, even if they did, knew enough to know what danger signs to look for. Under different circumstances it would've been a lot different. WTF?!? You can play the "if only" game all day long, but ultimately, it's nothing. "This is my (completely layman's) opinion, but I've always figured that we have more or less tamped down the "How" of the brain, but we're still working on the "Why" of the brain.". "However, there is credible, tangible, measurable, and repeatable evidence that there are some people, for whatever reason, have their brains wired differently.". The problem, Cullen concludes, was that there is almost nothing that can be done to help psychopaths. I'm with VoTN on this one. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Sociopaths are born, but people who remain sociopaths as they age: either missed puberty; or had bad parents. Really just the gerden variety sociopath stuff? "So we're back to Pavlov and Skinner. It just seems all a bit odd. One particular incident was uncovered where Dylan and Eric (the other shooter) were surrounded by a group, pushed around, called slurs, and had ketchup sprayed on them. He's wearing a plaid shirt, either dark blue or black with white; the shirt's untucked. Serious victim mentality with both of them. When I was 16 my parents sure as hell would have known if I had firearms in my possession or were building pipe bombs anywhere near our home. 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Eric says if either the clerk or his father had asked just one question, "we would have been fucked.". His parents didnt understand the full extent of it, but high school wasnt turning out to be a kind place for him. ", [quote]Eric: "Morris, Nate, if you guys live, I want you guys to have whatever you want from my room and the computer room.". Eric's dad answered a phone call from Green Mountain Guns. "How do you teach someone to have emotions or empathy?". As I often do, Ill leave the author the last word on why understanding the process her son went through is important: Dylan was vulnerable in many ways unquestionably emotionally immature, depressed, possibly suffering from a more serious mood or personality disorder. A few weeks ago, I reviewed Sue Klebolds memoir A Mothers Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy, about her experience as the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the Columbine High School shooters. In Cub Scouts, he was a bright, dedicated boy who worked hard for his badges. Dylan Klebold, along with his friend Eric Harris, shot and killed 13 people and injured 23 others in April, 1999 in Columbine High School, before they turned their guns on . He deflates a lot of myths surrounding the event. Read a little more about the case, R28. In them, its obvious to see how his anger and rage turned from being directed toward himself to directed toward others. What happened to them? They may show cruelty to animals, or alternatively a high degree of affection or attachment to animals. No one could control him. It didn't help matters any that our father was an abusive asshole. Her son's name became famous when in 1999 he became one of two direct perpetrators of the deadliest high school shooting in U.S. history. Let's set aside the pipe bomb issue and Eric's scrapes with the law for a moment and ask why they weren't more involved with their kid. She went to Ohio State University where she dated Tom. He'd gone with a traditional black tuxedo, bow tie slightly askew. The testimony people point out of a co-worker stating Dylan didnt get on with his father is unreliable as he couldve been having a teenage moan or joining in one time right up to regular bitterly disparaging remarks and reasons why. I can handle them "spending too much time on the killers", but unfortunately I recognize there are too many whackjobs in this country who would just see it as glorification. Think of kids who commit suicide - often you hear their family say, "We had no idea." I havent done anything for which I need forgiveness, Susan Klebold said. There was a creepy thread started by a sociopathic OP a couple of weeks ago where this was discussed. Eric's parents were both born in Colorado but while his father Wayne Harris was working in the Air Force as a transport pilot, Wayne held 11 different positions at six different bases in Ohio . ". You unterstand. Indeed, R96. I seem to remember them being called "fag.". The big trifecta of psychopathology. Pais was a student at Miami Beach High School who was reportedly obsessed with the school shooting at Columbine, the high school where 13 people were shot and killed 20 years ago. He went to his senior prom and based on his journal had a wonderful time, and was invested in his future to such an extent that he chose a college and made a trip out to Arizona to look at dorm rooms with his father. His father was a geophysicist and a mother worked with the disabled . None of us knows exactly how the brain works. I can't believe Oprah canceled her Columbine show today. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold are once more in the family room of the Harris home. They weren't bullied, and they weren't outcasts; all of that came from the non-stop media echo chamber that followed the events. She just took interest and responsibility for what I did as long as I was both underage and under her roof. As a literature teacher, symbolism is not lost on me. A Mothers Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy. There are a myriad of factors to consider. [quote]You have to ignore a whole lot of what is wrong with society to limit it to a bogus discussion about how some people have "brains wired differently." I recently watched the documentary Raising Adam Lanza, and, though it wasnt as detailed, there were some interesting overlaps between Adam and Dylan. We are not there yet. Its hard to tell. This week, one of them, Sue Klebold mother of shooter Dylan Klebold - breaks the silence with ABC's Diane Sawyer. We've never left. Thats Something that stands out about Dylan anyway, the Lack of Emotion regarding his parents. R71, having seen Patti Lupone shit all over Gypsy, I can assure you, there's a Hell. Adding to the tragedy: Six months after Hochhalter's wounding, her mother, Carla, took her own life. Dylan says people will note the date and time when watching it. Dylan: "Hey mom. Too bad. His parents were Wayne and Katherine. When I hear this "We never knew a thing was wrong with our child!" . I worked as a dishwasher, then busboy then waiter in a German-American restaurant years ago when I was growing up. : apparently tom was really hurt when 4/20 happened and grieved heavily because he felt like him and dylan were best friends, and had especially gotten closer in the months prior. There's a blurb on the back flap comparing the book to Helter Skelter and In Cold Blood, and I thought that was just kind of typical PR purple mumbo-jumbo. It would be satisfying to blame the parents. VERIFY: In the past 20 years did the majority of mass shooters take psychotropic drugs? The oblivious parents in Target or sitting inside their houses listening to their kids having a meltdown and completely ignoring it. When it came to intervention, these people had no idea what they should have been doing. His parents didnt yet know to monitor his internet usage. Im going to start by reviewing what Bartol & Bartol (2017) have to say about school shooters (and shootings) as a group, though they also state there is no single school shooter profile. They could still have been on the outskirts of the school. What happened isn't their fault. Bull fucking shit. Yodack is a website that writes about many topics of interest to you, a blog that shares knowledge and insights useful to everyone in many fields. She has spent the last 15 years excavating every detail of her family life, and trying to understand the crucial intersection . Similiarly if a child is screaming at playmates and/or siblings and will not stop, you have to move in and take control of the situation. 17 year old son of Mr. Thomas Klebold (then 52) and Mrs. Susan (Yassenoff) Klebold (then 50), younger brother to Byron. Not only had Dylan experienced bullying in school, his school fit some of the factors that meant it was most at risk for a shooting by ignoring certain behaviors and otherwise unevenly enforcing the rules. It would drive me insane to have my kids behave like that, but some people are utterly oblivious to the cacaphony and strife being caused by their children. What I am saying is that the cause is something deeper and more primal than "society.". I think he was broken over the loss of his son, and wants to remember the boy Dylan was and not the murder he became? People need to understand this could have happened to them, he said. The parents cars were in the driveway. Tom is a geophysicist, Sue works with handicapped people. Im horrified, Dawn Anna, whose daughter Lauren Townsend was killed at Columbine, told The Associated Press. After I wrote a column a few weeks ago about the 1999 shootings at Columbine High School, I got e-mail from Tom Klebold, the father of Dylan Klebold, one of the . Both were from Columbus, Ohio and went to Ohio State University. FULL DOCO - PT 2 OF 3, 2. People can be fooled. When the clerk told him "Hey, your clips are in." His negative traits werent out of the ordinary either, really: he was very sensitive to embarrassment, which sometimes led to anger; and he was perhaps a little too independent, where he wouldnt ask for help even if he needed it like when he had to take a break from baseball after pains he never mentioned became so bad they caused his arm real damage. Based on what I've read so far, he's working off the assumption that Klebold was a depressive with self-destructive tendencies (he mentions suicide over and over in the journal kept for two years prior to the incident), and that Harris was a full-blown psychopath. ", "If they had even one shred of decency they would have taken full responsibility for creating and shaping and not monitoring these monsters.". "In the very . His father was an Air Force pilot, and moved him and his . Sue acknowledges that before Columbine, she would have reacted to news of some horrific act by wondering what that persons parents must have been like to allow someone to turn out like that. Or is your tiny mind only capable of two viewpoints? He was steady enough on his feet to run, but not to stop himself from losing balance and falling, which he did, forehead-first right into the metal bed frame. Hey mom, gotta go Tom isnt even included in the insincere goodbye. Oprah asked the teachers to describe Harris/Klebold, the teachers talked about how they didn't fit in, wore trenchcoats, seemed troubled and dangerous, and so on. Sue Klebold with son Dylan in 1985. Credit: Sue Klebold via Penguin/Random House Tall, slim and graceful (her younger son was a gangly 193 centimetres tall), she is given to direct eye contact . r109 is quick to dismiss r108 as a "troll". Neither seemed to know where or with whom he was most of the time. These things outweighed their concerns about him. It is actually a lot of conformist bunk to serve the status quo. Parents were not paying attention to what was in plain sight, or didn't want to deal with it. r54 is right. additionally, dylan was definitely naturally shy. I got picked on a lot and dealt with a lot of shit from the "jocks" and the "cool kids." And psychiatrists, rather dubious "doctors" push drugs. Here's what you need to know: 1. The glaring one that Americans seem unable to see is the huge amount of available weapons in the US. Dylan was giddy and beaming, all cleaned up for once. [quote]I think he made only one phone call to a recruiter. Tonight, an interview with Sue Klebold, Dylan's mother, is set to air on the ABC news-magazine . They are particularly good at it. You teach people to manage their condition. . However, it is my understanding from reviews that he contends the boys actually had a circle of friends and were, in fact, popular within that group. It would be comforting to think otherwise. Not to cure it, to manage it. [quote]He had been in a gifted child program, and you'd think they'd have some type of monitoring since kids who are that advanced frequently have problems. (The OP was looking for books on personality mirroring and other techniques sociopaths use). Second, the reason no one at the school noticed is because no one is ever trained to notice. Dylan Klebold Character Analysis. Getty, AP, AP, AFP/Getty. Both parents were gentle, educated people, who named their two boys after romantic poets x97 Dylan Thomas and Lord Byron x97 seemed to have given Dylan the message that so many of us recognize from our own childhoods: high school is hard, it will get better from here, wex92re here for you, we promise. Weren't they in a small group of rebellious kids? I can't remember. When he heard reports of gunmen in trench coats rampaging through Columbine High, it's reported, that Thomas Klebold (the father of Dylan) contacted authorities, because he suspected his son might be involved and offered his help as a negotiator.. You have to ignore a whole lot of what is wrong with society to limit it to a bogus discussion about how some people have "brains wired differently." It's always about management. Family & Personal Life. Nothing taken care of that I needed him to do (like take care of the cats). Unfortunately, we only have her word today as to what went on in the home. I do find it odd that you'd characterise your 17 year old son as your 'best friend' anyway, you're his father. (Video) My son was a Columbine shooter. The bombing was planned for April 19th, to coincide with the Oklahoma bombing, but for some reason, they were set back to the 20th.